Water4Gas discussion

I am glad that this discussion has taken place. It has nudged me toward learning how engines work, which is a good thing to know. Anyway...

So far, I have learned that the idea of water4gas is to use a device that creates H2 out of water and then having that H2 pulled through the intake port and into the piston to create a more energetic explosion for each combustion (the third step of the four-stroke combustion cycle). While this seems plausible, there are some concerns that are naturally raised. In the post that follows this, I will explain my concerns and my conclusion.

- One concern that I have is that the amount of hydrogen created from a mason jar full of water seems far too less to have any significant impact. The air/gas ratio within each combustion is ideally at 14.6 to 1. That is 14.6 parts air to every 1 part gasoline. This means that for every 1 gallon of gasoline burned, approximately 2 cubic feet (2'x2'x2') of hydrogen must be produced in order to replace normal air for the intake with pure hydrogen. That is a lot of hydrogen to produce with a mason jar. Does this disprove this yet? No. Does it seem realistic? ...

- Another concern is that the car uses electricity to seperate the hydrogen from the oxygen. The energy that the car uses to split the elements would obviously take away SOME from any profit of the device. This does not mean that it would completely negate the benefit, but its something to consider. Some have claimed that the water4gas idea violates the 1st law of thermodynamics, but I do not think that the idea does. Still, the electricity needed to produce sufficient hydrogen would overload a car battery.

- The approach of the people who are trying to sell this solution, convince me that it is a scam. The fact that people say that they improve their fuel efficiency by 50% or more and that they are willing to sell you the manual on how to do this for $97 tells me that this is a hoax. Unfortunately, inventions that have this sort of impact are not sold at a cheap price. New innovations that could save every American hundreds or thousands of dollars a year are not marketed by spammers on youtube or by people willing to give you a referral fee. The simple fact that the sellers of this product chose this method of marketing their product tells me that they are not onto something big.

- Why haven't there been any controlled tests of this process that have produced good results? Maybe I am just missing them, but I can't find any on the internet.

My conclusion: Although some of the ideas of replacing normal air intake with hydrogen intake COULD work, the scale for the water4gas idea is not a realistic way to improve your gas mileage. Additionally, seeing the ways that this product has been brought to market signals to me that this is a scam.

Brain Train,

I don't expect you to stop making your water4gas devices. All that I am saying is that when the subject is brought up, the above conclusion is what I have to offer so far.

The big problem I've had with w4g since I first heard of it was a complete lack of empirical evidence to support the claims made by w4g advocates. All I would need to see to prove to me that this technology works is a simple controlled test. What do I have in mind? Set the engine up on a test rig. Run a control without the w2g device. Then, run the engine with the w2g device activated. Without the isolation that a test rig offers (consistent air temperature, consistent throttle application, consistent load on the engine, etc), it's impossible to determine exactly what is effecting gas mileage.

I've read studies about HHO applications on the internet that show a marked increase in gas mileage, but the ratios of HHO to regular air are much higher than could conceivably be issued from a mason jar, especially considering the amount of current necessary to produce that much HHO.